Episode 3
Charlotte Mair
Founder and Managing Director of The Fitting Room
ON THIS EPISODE OF ‘JUST ONE THING’:
Our guest on this episode is the wonderful Charlotte Mair, founder and managing director of The Fitting Room, an award-winning agency she founded seven years ago with just £17.22 in her bank account.
She believes culture comes first and it's at the heart of everything she does. She runs her agency driven by a deep understanding of sub-cultures that go on to shape popular culture and influence behaviour.
Her fail-fast mantra has shaped so much of her career and business. She believes that failure isn’t the end, in fact, it’s a step to where you want to get to.
Charlotte has just got back from New York where she has been working with Idris Elba to promote his new Netflix film Luther: The Fallen Sun.
Watch Charlotte on YouTube or listen to her on Spotify, Apple or Google podcasts
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Dear pop culture and hip-hop loving Charlotte from 2000,
Well, I guess this means you’re doing the damn thing!
When you set off on this mission to build something (totally naively 😂 😅) that embodied the best parts of pop culture, where you wanted to get to was perfectly clear, but the steps and journey wasn’t. But you are getting there.
Taking your core beliefs and embedding them into the heart and DNA of the agency you create you called The Fitting Room, allows you to build a team of some of the best talent in the game. People that are honest, loyal and brilliant. “Don’t Forget to Live” and “‘Don’t Forget to Learn” becomes part of The Fitting Room’s DNA and you encourage your team to embody that in their lives, both professionally and personally. This is powerful stuff.
Your fail fast mantra, will help you shape so much of your career and business, showing other young people how to be fearless and being an example to them of how you can run straight into the fire. Showing them that failure isn’t the end, in fact it’s a step to where you want to get to.
Starting a business with £17.22 is no easy job, but you do run into the fire and take the ‘L’s as they come.
Being aware of what some people would consider disadvantages has actually been key to the winning. Mum and Dad’s ‘you will have to work 10 times harder‘ speech actually helped you flourish. This aligned with your high regard for integrity which has paved the way and allowed you to pass the baton on to others. Lifting as you climb.
Finally, Charlotte, every so often, take a moment odd to enjoy where you are now. You only get to do this life once.
Fail fast!
Charlotte (2023)
PS f*ck the fear Charlotte and f*ck the glass ceiling while you’re at it.
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Mel: If I Could Tell You Just One Thing presented by me, Mel Noakes
Max: And me, Max Fellows. If I Could Tell You Just One Thing is a brand-new event industry podcast brought to you by Elevate.
Mel: It's where industry leaders write a letter to their younger self and consider what wise advice, they would give themselves now if they only could. Our discussion is based all around this letter, be prepared for refreshingly honest, sincere conversations and some wise words of wisdom.
Max: This podcast is powered by Wonder, an independent specialist creative events agency, who are reimagining what's possible across the business experiences. We hugely appreciate their support in bringing this series of podcasts to life.
Mel: Our next guest is the wonderful Charlotte Mair, founder and managing director of The Fitting Room and award-winning agency she founded seven years ago with just 17 pounds, 22 Pence in her bank account.
Max: She believes culture comes first and it's the heart of everything she does. She runs her agency driven by a deep understanding of subcultures that go on to shape popular culture and influence behaviour.
Mel: She's just got back from New York where she has been working with Idris Elba to promote his new Netflix film Luther, the fallen son.
Max: This is an insane conversation.
Mel: You are not going to want to miss this one. So, Charlotte, thank you so much for joining us today. Can you introduce yourself and tell people a little bit about what you do for those that don't know you?
Charlotte: Yes, I am Charlotte, and I am the Founder and Managing Director of Communications and culture agency of The Fitting Room.
Mel: Amazing and tell us a little bit about what the fitting room does.
Charlotte: So, the fitting room is built on three pillars, and they are, we create hype, demand and legacy for brands and businesses. So, hype is the reimagined version of what the marketing books told us 20 years ago, that is the awareness phase. The demand part is kind of the key part of the funnel that gets a customer acquisition and conversion. And the legacy is the thing that keeps people talking and keeps people recommending you.
Mel: Amazing.
Max: You’re doing really well right now. So, thank you so much. Also, for them writing the letter. It's an exposing kind of exercise to an extent and shares some vulnerabilities as well. But it's really good to get an understanding of people who they are and what they're all about. Yours was brilliant. And Mel was just telling us he came in to hear about that kind of not wanting to get into this woman's wave of being.
Mel: Energy off the page. You get that in like.
Charlotte: I was quite subdued in that I thought.
Mel: Oh wow, in fact you are, yeah.
Charlotte: I was like really thinking about my words and what I was putting out, it was a little bit like therapy actually.
Max: Therapy. I want to ask because of the hip hop pieces to what is your favourite all time classic. What's going to kind of get you moving?
Charlotte: Biggie ‘Juicy’. My team got me trainers customised for my birthday and that's so sick. And I've written about him a lot and how he is the perfect example of our principles of hype, demand, legacy, you know, Biggie has gone what? 1995. He still has brand deals like you know, that's the same they still release trainers under Philo, they still do brand exercise of a Kef, like he is the perfect example of those three strands. And what that can do for brands be that a person or a business.
Max: Yeah, that massive legacy piece and slightly off topic. But I was just saying earlier as having checked out the website and things is that real opinion piece in a kind of insights driven way and that's what I think brilliant in terms of that. Put the kind of money where your mouth is, and this is the thinking of the team. This is what we kind of about and that passion and what you guys are about and yeah, that was a really good article as well.
Charlotte: That's our DNA like we won't ask clients do anything we wouldn't do so. You know, just before lockdown November 2019. We throw a disco for our Christmas party, we hired outhaul, we had DJ luckily MC knee, we have sweet female attitude. We had a gospel choir, 150 of our clients, my parents, grandparents, my god parents, like it was a madness. But we you know, when we talk to clients about hide from them during parties and like living and breathing it ,I was like, well, we need to get some money in the ring don't we. So, we will never say from start to finish to do anything that I wouldn't personally put my hands in my pocket and do myself.
Mel: I love that, that's like work and family there. There's a real blender, that's me. This is all of me. This isn't just like my work persona or the work thing. This is all of who I am.
Charlotte: I always say to my team, I'll say exactly to your face what I would say if you weren't in the room. Like I just, I'm just very uncomplicated in that way. And that's a big part of getting through life in a very positive way, where you don't have to worry about what you said. Because you know, you wouldn't have said anything that you said would have been said with integrity and that's huge. In the world of social media and instant gratification, knowing that you're not going to get gratification cuz you're probably gonna say something that people at first a lot of shit, you know, as if she's just said that, is a whole different conversation, especially when you're on an agency where you are, technically meant to be quite pleasant and like yeah, of course I can do that. I'm very like that. But I'm also like, no, that's wrong for your brand. Let's have this conversation that runs from start to finish in our DNA as a business.
Mel: And that real sense of self and composure and self-belief really comes through in your letter actually, from a very young age, this sense of I can do this and if I can't do it, I'm going to figure it out. Where does that come from?
Charlotte: My parents. Definitely my parents, my mum and dad worked really hard to move us out of the area where they were raised. Not that there was anything wrong with that area, but to make sure that we all got into grammar schools. My mum was like obsessed, obsessed with our education. And I then went and did everything she didn't want me to do. I dropped out of uni, left grammar school to go to a high school to have my boyfriend at 16. Like everything you can imagine, that would work against your parents is what I did. But I always wanted to work, whereas my older brother, he's got a first-class degree and honors from UCL in math, like whereas I was like, let me work, let me work. Like I wanted to get out and I was making money from a very young age, throwing parties and selling tickets, you name it, it was already happening. And so, I think my dad saw that in me quite early on, and instead of sort of pushing it down or exposing me to what the world was going to be like when I actually stepped into it as grown folk. He told me to keep going and so I kept going and he you know, my parents are amazing, but they are a bit tough, and I think watching what they push through, there was no way there's four of us, three other siblings. There was no way that any of us were going to settle. And actually that's where when we talk about how to run legacy again, all of those things played into my love for America, running around New York, the big life, the people that came from the projects, how they've grown into these multi billionaires was always fascinating to me, not because of the money but because of the level of resilience and the drive for excellence, that that took for them to get to those tables to do what. For Dr. Dre to sell beats to Apple for however many billions. That is a different kind of mindset to get up and do and to work through. So, I've always taken that. And my dad isn't a hip hop man at all. He's a Motown guy. But I think some of those principles around culture come through so much in our music in the entertainment world that we naturally gravitate to it as a community.
Max: How much of it for you, do you think is that nature versus nurture in terms of that? Because it comes across again in that that letter of this real drive this ambition, this entrepreneurial kind of spirit and I wonder how much is, do you feel is just I've always had that, versus the coaching if you like or the kind of nurturing of the parents?
Charlotte: I think I've always had it. I was head girl. I was, you know, managing director of a young enterprise at high school, all of those things were in me, I think that it's, I think it's a combination of the two, but I do believe in the fact that you are a product of your environment. I think that that is significant, and I probably have cut off more people in my adult life than I did in my teams because the energy just wasn't quite right for me. And I felt like I was always pouring into other people, and they were just taking, and I was getting home, and I was like fuck I'm exhausted. Because I just feel like you've just taken all of me and I'm not quite sure what I got back, and I think that that is a big part of it. If you met my team and spoke to our clients, they'd be like, this is a high performing energetic team, like they do not stop. We're like, that's the win. And I'm that boss that they sent me an email on the website isn't good enough. No, like it just isn't tolerated. And I say to them, there's a 20% excellent tax. So, I'm like, if you think that's good, go into another 20% on it. And then it'd be great. And that is the whole mindset of our business. And some people come and they're like, this is bang and somebody will come in, they're like no, this isn't for me. And I'm okay with that. Because I understand that the principles that I'm building my life on don't necessarily match what everybody else wants. Somebody wants to settle, they want an easier life, but I want it like hip hop had it.
Max: Don't you think it takes a bit of bravery and you mentioned there and kind of nodding away. That coming back and more so from I think extroverts that you are giving and giving and giving and asking the question, I think that's always the thing is you kind of realized at the end of a question you've not asked a single question on what do you know about me, in terms of a catch up and stuff. And so, these people that you said that you've cut off at what point, and these are friends or peers you've had for a while or these people kind of you're doing it meeting. And I'm asking I suppose from a point where anyone else who is in those circumstances or situations to kind of identify actually go you know what? to point about the kind of pulling from the cap piece of things. How would you identify that or acknowledge the time is then to go at you know what? it's about me a bit more.
Mel: I think as young women we are socially conditioned from birth that we must be liked. We are meant to do certain things that make us likeable. If you're not likeable, you're this, you're that, you're the other and then that's driven further by pop culture movies, or the rom coms, you know, the mean, girls, all of that energy is driven into us. And I think it's very hard for women in particular, to understand that worth and say actually, that's just unacceptable. And that's not what I want around me. I as a black teenager was definitely a person trying to fit in with people that weren't really ever going to be my people long term. And it's that classic thing when your mum’s like, they're not really your friend and you're like, yes, they are, mum shut up and they were right. Oh, no, I really need to find some new friends and I think I proactively went out to find people that matched my values and people that I thought could have genuine fun with, like I gave up drinking in for I knew that COVID was going to hit us in the face, December 2019 and have been sober since. And when you take away the getting wasted on a Monday just because you become a different personality and you take on a different role. And you notice that certain invitations stop. That in itself was a shift. That only made me even more focused on it because everyone else around me drinks, we represent loads of bars and restaurants, so much booze in our office. And that's a different kind of mindset. And I think you read, start when you remove alcohol. I think you really get to start to know who you are and who the people are around you because there isn't any pretense, there isn't anything to hide or cover up you're just like, well, this is me, like deal, but I do think as women, it's a hard thing. And I think as well like, you know, you all have all of the stories of high school and friendships are very romanticized. So, if you get to a grown-up age and you've got no friends from high school, it's like oh, what's wrong with her? When actually people don't understand that in school, you are predominantly shoved together and you're trying to be something that you're probably not if you remove all of these external factors. And for me, I've still got loads of my school friends, but our relationships are different and our expectations of each other are different. And I ended up because I was so hungry around a lot of men that I spent, and I think that drove my determination even more because they were, they weren't apologetic about it about what they wanted. And so, in those circles that influence your mindset. People always laugh when I say that I'm a Pisces. Because they're like you're more Aries energy but I have a Pisces but it's you know, we represent pop culture, but I also understand the negatives of what pop culture does in the way of conditioning people to tell them what they should be, versus actually who they are when you lift the lid.
Mel: And it's amazing to see because you have, like we said earlier, this sort of strength of well, I'm not going to conform to the things that you expect, in the sense of having your own mind and your own ideals and also recognizing some of those things at quite an early age to go. That's not right. That's not for me, again, from your parents.
Charlotte: Yeah, they were tough, they're like the best people so they were tough. They were just very real with us about it. And where we were raised, Norway area, we're the only black family with any black family and our primary school and everything else. So, when we got home, and the front door closed, that was our safe space. We could just be, and I think that as well there were lonely times within that and on this journey of entrepreneurship, outside whatever you want to call it, when you can be on your own, and actually really live in your thoughts. I think that is when so much can change because life is so busy. I step on my front door and I'm like, here we go. But when I go into my front door, I'm like, okay, this is my silence. This is my solitude. I spent quite a lot of time at my parent’s house as well just being because you can just be and if you met my siblings as well, where all three of us have got our own companies. My younger sister is studying fashion at Central Saint Martins at the moment. She's doing years internship, so she's working for me at the moment for a year. We are all about mindset and she's 22, big age gap with us. But she's definitely taken the ells that we've had. And she found her fearlessness about 19 which was early for me. So again, I do believe you are to a degree a product of your environment and life short. I just, I were here for a minute. I think that not enough people think about it like that when you actually realize what your impact is going to be and how insignificant you’re kind of are, right? Social media has got us thinking that we're special. There's loads of us, right? So, my thing is like, just go for it and if I don't like something now, what's the worst that can happen? Someone doesn't like me okay.
Max: Well, then that gives you, we were chatting about that, that sense of I suppose bravery some might think kind of wow, that confidence and things like that, that it takes away the fear of not being liked or that fear of someone saying no, which gives you this edge really, I suppose. And so, you're saying about that in terms of the self-starter, this entrepreneur things like that and you are successful for sure in the company's killing, doing really well.
Charlotte: At the beginning of our journey, I don't think so.
Max: Okay, well, on the beginning, then, looking forward to seeing what's coming on that journey then, there's obviously must have been some times where it hasn't been all kind of, you know, what of those times then, if there are any that have taught you more of, what are the kind of lessons or learnings I suppose from them and what were those times like?
Charlotte: So, it's interesting because our pillars are height demand legacy about internal message. I say to the team is don't believe the hype. So, you know, which is ironic, I appreciate the difference between people getting caught up in their own noise and the reality of the world that we live in. So, for me, I've had so many ells when I started this agency, I did not have a Scooby what I was doing, I read a book and then I went to my bosses and I said, yo, I'm going to start by an agency and they were like, okay, and actually they were very kind, and they turned my job into my first retailers. They outsourced my job to me, and they gave me space at their office in Shore ditch and they let me keep my company laptop. And I think the thing about taking ells is so much emphasis is put on not failing in the UK. If we look to the US they celebrate failing, they love a comeback story. We don't, we kind of do the opposite. We wait to build someone up and then we crash them down. And then we'd like them to stay down. So, I think that for me, I've made so many mistakes, but in making the mistakes. I've also been focused on training myself to be better. I spent a lot of time crafting my job and I don't think a lot of people do spend time practicing getting better. You come in and you do the routine, and you do what you're told to do. And you get through the to do list. I said to my team yesterday, guys, if I gave you 25 grand just hire someone who would it be, and they were like oh and I was like I just think fuck it. Let's just do a wild card hire and see what we get, like let them bring a vibe. And so, my senses were in there like Charlotte, my finances they're like Charlotte. But for me, I'm like, well, what are we going to lose here in reality like, and that's I think even more so since COVID taking the ells and not being scared of failure. You know, we went into COVID thinking, oh my god, we just had our best year, and I was like we are so sad, cashflow everything we're good. Nobody could control what was about to hit everybody without really any notice. And that just completely reset us. It is very much what's the worst that can happen. And we have rules, we say no to 50% of what comes to us just as a general, let's not be first day. We haven't done our due diligence if 100% of what gets offered to us, we believe is right for us as a business and those pulling out. Those things come with lots of learnings because most of the time I've got it right. But sometimes I've got it wholly wrong in those decisions.
Max: You mentioned in your letter about starting out and referencing there kind of with a laptop and was it 17 quid in the pocket?
Charlotte: £17.22 to be precise, I had to start a business on 17 pounds.Max: Was it naivety not knowing the kind of the bigger picture actually. Was it the narrative going, yeah, well that could be but let's have it to your point. What's the worst that can happen?
Charlotte: I think so my advisory board, Graham particular calls me, he's like ‘I love your naivety because you just go and do what you believe to be right. You're not set up by the constructs of what agency world should be and what you should be doing’. And that's been really significant for us. Because some of my fearlessness comes from, I don't know what could happen. There's my romanticized dream of how brilliant it could be. And then there's the very real reality that if you let enough people talk you out of a situation and this is where your environment is important. You won't do it. But the point is, so few people are actually doing it. The lane of actually achieving and of actually winning and living a life where you're like yeah, I did the damn thing is so short because so many people are staying within what they were told to do and how they were told to live. And even if you just take 20% out of that mindset and go fuck it and go off and try and do it. You're ahead of the rest of the pack anyway. So, I don't even think you have to be 100% it. You just have to do a little bit of a little nudge every week and you'll be doing it differently. And you'll be failing fast and getting up and going again, but again, as a young black person, what's the worst that can happen? Like, you know, we, our ancestors walked so we could run like, I would be wrong to be on this earth and not be absolutely going for it. It would be disrespectful to my parents. With the sacrifice that they made and there's no greater driver than that because the worst has already happened to our people as a whole.
Mel: It's really interesting because this is where the idea of the podcast came really was, that celebration of the things that you learned that make you stronger and not just that you learn maybe but the environment around you, the people around you and coming back stronger and you get a real sense of that through you and actually this sense of and I love the agency ethos, like don't forget to live, don't forget to learn and that sense of actually it's a learning opportunity. You get up, you dust off, you go again. Has that always been there?
Charlotte: Yeah, I think so. I think what we did last year was I started to put pen to paper. So, when we launched don't forget to live, it was because DeeDee had started on a Friday having Fuckit Fridays and I was like, why don't we work Fridays? My mum was like, because it's a business and I was like no mum, that is not a good enough reason.
Max: For Fridays, so however you're doing you've got to be doing having fun. Got to be doing it in an environment or doing something you having fun doing. Yeah.
Charlotte: Well, we used to have those moments whenever we hit the target. I would just go right, and I just go spend a load of money. And over the summer we gave the team four-day weeks under don't forget to live and then we sat in the office in the second week of September. Gosh, it was a Friday and should go to IB for next week. And the team were like what should I be for? And they were like, are you joking, and I just sat there and looked at and we went for I think 22 hours alone and just partied and they're all gasp because they met Wally. They were living their best lives and then you know we do Coachella. So, five of them. I'm taking to Coachella; we literally live in like three weeks and we do a night partying in LA before we go down to Palm Springs. And then don't forget to learn was the second part that I launched in December, just gone and that meant that they got Friday afternoons off in January. And I pulled together a list of things that they could do in London, free museums, everything else and then we paid everyone to do a course. So, Kate, who's our junior strategist, he went off to learn how to do acrylic nails. Some people went to DJ school, somebody who has skiing lessons. Some people started ballet, Danielle learned to fire brie, and it was probably better than don't forget to live because they, I always say to them like don't grow up as a trick, you know, when they're sat there in their twenties in front of me saying oh you know I just dah, dah, dah. I'm like don't do it. Don't believe the hype of when you get to this, you'll have this, when you have this and I'm like no right now. Go and do what you would have done if you hadn't been made to grow up, with that gas bill wasn't hitting your email. What would you be doing with your time and we; it was important to us that it wasn't just about us telling them. I was like we wrote a budget, there is a budget for those things to make sure that they are doing them. It's not just something that we write on LinkedIn and go aren't we great and all that wonkiness, it's a proper thing.
Max: Which happens all too often doesn't it? And a massive part of Elevate and why we founded this is because companies will say okay, you know as part of their onboarding or to attract talent is and we've got this big bursary and the social committee and you know, you can do all the training you like and less than 90%, 95%, even actually take that up and lo and behold, three years later, they're kind of getting too busy and things like that. I'm keying in on the premise of being too busy and you being the agency owner, how do you learn and how do you live in terms of all taking the time and moments to make sure you kind of live those same values?
Charlotte: So I just took one of my team to New York, and we were out there working a project but we also were there because it's 50 years of hip hop, that's Hip Hop 50 this year, and there are loads of exhibitions and everything else and I was like, let's go and immerse ourselves and again, the product that we sell and the community that we've you know, our base has been built on. So, for me, it's those trips, I spent a lot of time in the US, my friends out there just a different level, and means that we get to do the most insane things. I think one of my team actually when we want to be contractors for Christmas, they said what are you going to do to celebrate and I said, well, I don't actually need anything. I've got enough stuff; I don't really want any more stuff. If I want to take a holiday, I'll take a holiday, but I don't. For me, it's them. Actually, the better the clients the better the work. The more money in the bank, the more we can spend on encouraging them to be great humans. If you mess the, I will say we probably have four employees over our run that has ended in a way that I wish had been better. But the bulk of our former employees I speak to nearly every day, I get their life updates. I get that everything because they trust me implicitly and I will help them with anything that I can now, and I think that that for me is my living and learning and like today I think I achieved absolutely nothing in the office, I literally hung out with a team. I wasn't in my office, I came and sat with them. We were just chatting about, God even knows and just banter and everything else and that for me in terms of lifting, I'm passing the baton down is my living and learning I think of how we leave this place better.
Max: What I find is so refreshing as we're talking, I've got this massive smile on my face because it's refreshing. All you seem to see and hear through podcasts and social media things is full of pressure. As an entrepreneur or someone that's trying to do something of needing to earn it whilst you sleep and passive income and the pressures of it and, you know, five-day weeks before crossing it and doing it all the time when you've had a good day. But it's a good day because you've spent time with the team not because you've smashed his pitches or because you've learnt loads and things like that. I think it's so refreshing to hear that from a successful entrepreneur or an even more successful entrepreneur. How do you think that that's going to change, or have you thought about it as where this is growing?
Charlotte: We're already feeling it where we're adding in additional processes. And I think that's where things like the trips to Coachella, the surprising the team with IB, all of those things, are those legacy things they'll always remember, oh my God at TFR Charlotte's Web Summit. We're getting on a plane today and we're going here. And I think that I won't play that role in the business. I will never be the processor doing that. And whilst I've sat hanging out with the team, I'm on WhatsApp, creating other deals. It just looks different because we have such strong relationships because we have such strong foundations with the people that we serve. New business looks very, very, very different for us. Because all of that stuff on LinkedIn. I'm just like no, like what a nonsense and what are we even saying to young people? Is the reality of life, if you want anything you have to work hard for it, but you have to choose your heart. I just this get rich quick nonsense. I just, I'm going to become an influencer. I mean how many people are actually making money and is sustainable for longer than the two years after you come off that reality show. We're doing young people a disservice. And that's why with my team, I am tough in the sense of giving them feedback. I'm like, this is the real-world guys, like but in equal measure, my God do they turn up for it? So, part of the reason we brought in the head of agency who's very process driven, was because she's less of a dreamer, you know, and that allows me to be like, right? You know, when I say oh, we're gonna get this in and everyone's like, are you mad and I'm like, hold tight, and my team when we started winning. When we started winning the big FMCG stuff and started getting into the room, invited into the rooms. Danielle my business lead said to me said to me, you asked us to give you six months, you did it and four and a half. So that coming through on your word as well, like I would never write stuff on LinkedIn, or anywhere on social media that wasn't true. If one of my and I encourage my team to use LinkedIn, I'm always on their asses about coming in writing about their day and what they've seen that they liked, and even that you watch this confidence grow in these young people in there that are 22, you know, LinkedIn is this big, scary thing, but we're just not doing it right, actually. We're not doing it.
Mel: I love this. You get a real sense. And you said something in what you said earlier about passing the baton on. And obviously, our version of that is sending the elevator back down and just making sure you support those coming through and you get such a sense of that through so much. So, who are the people that helped pull you through other than your parents, who are the people that pass the baton to you?
Charlotte: So, my circle has changed quite a lot in the last few years. I have my best, best, best friends that have been with me since school or through my 20s but and this is gonna sound so strange. I just kind of when I need certain resources based on my mindset, I go and find them. So quite often, it isn't a person. It might be something that I've read. It might be something that I've seen, but it's also just, it's just never that bad. I think I don't, I have great friends. I have my advisory board Graham, the chairman of Frank PR. He's exceptional. He's been really good to me, but there are just lots of older people that just take the time because I always turn up with something for them. Like, you know, there's always I'm joining an investment firm at the moment on their advisory board, and I've knew nothing about investments until about two years ago, we started to work private equity and how it all works. And they wanted me to come on and give them advice on what they should be investing in and what they should do with their next fund and everything else. And I went off and talked myself about it and started making investments so I could sit at that table. And I think that it's that it's the little conversations. My team will say you only read two lines of that how'd you know what that whole thing is? I'm like, because you're trained to do it and you read enough two lines, and you've got the whole story. And that's just I just take little bits from little things. But I've learned because of my upbringing, I learned to be alone. And I think that that is a huge thing. And then again not drinking there is no foggy head. I'm a bit tired. I have a bad period. I'm a bit of a grumpy but generally my mindset and everything stays there. I know where I'm operating. And that's really the biggest influence over a person.
Mel: So Charlotte, we were talking just before we came on air a little bit about your sense of the industry ,and what it takes to be successful, and maybe your experiences as a black entrepreneur. And the things that maybe were going through your head as you started this journey. And I think there's some really powerful lessons in there, potentially, for our listeners as well.
Charlotte: Yeah for me one of my main focuses has been drowning out the noise. And actually I switched off a lot of news bearing in mind the job that I do. I funnel, I'm very clear with what I'm listening to and what I'm putting into my space. I think that a lot of it is deliberately framed to keep certain parts of society believing that they can't do more. That's not a race thing that sits within the class structure of this country. It serves certain groups for people to believe that they can be no more. And I think that we, right now, a living in probably, one of the most divisive times in history. Of everything being such levels of extremity instead of people dealing with what's actually in front of them.
My team, when we, when we need something, I will normally say to them write to the CEO and their like what? I'm like, write to the CEO on LinkedIn because I guarantee you they'll come back to you and I have not been wrong one time since. Most people are decent people and we are being conditioned to believe that people are bad, people are this people are that, and it's just not the reality of the world that we actually live in. Yes, there are bad people. Yes, I'll be the the odd idiot, but the majority of people do want to help and again when they don't want to help, it's very rarely that someone doesn't want to help. It's normal that they're battling something on their own or they've got their own insecurities or the timing is off. It's never really that. They are deliberately trying to stop you from doing something and I say to a lot of young people that write to me on LinkedIn, I'm like, get off Instagram, get off Tik-Tok, and I use Instagram and Tik-Tok, but there they are rationed, I'm intentional with those channels, and get on to LinkedIn. If you got a streetwear brand and you're like, oh how do I take this to market? The buyer of Selfridges or wherever you want is on LinkedIn. That's where the grown-up conversations are happening and most people, if you reach out, you tell them your story, they will welcome you in.
We've had a role that blew up on LinkedIn. And I said, in my opening statement, I don't, you don't need experience to come and work for us. We've got a selection of roles every year that will be for anybody and the people that I took through two interviews, were the people that wrote to me separately through just applying through the standard roots. So I'd always say irrespective of where societies told you that you sit in life, everybody remembers this personal touch, everybody remembers the person that reached out. Everybody remembers the person that understands something about that person deeper than just the job that they do.
So I am a hopeless optimist that we can all have the things that we want, but we have to be intentional about it and nobody should let their religion, their skin colour, the way they look, anything, stop them from what they want to do, everyone's battling their own quiet demons. Nobody is as big as you think. Even when you look at Steven Bartlett, there will be things going on behind the scenes, that are impacting that person on a day-to-day basis, but if you wake up in the mornings and you believe that you can do it and you set the conditions for you to do it, you do your research, you do your homework, you craft and build what you actually want, rather than being swept up in the noise of Instagram and Tik-Tok.
I do believe that these young people, like some of the businesses being built on phones what they're achieving already is pretty vast, but the people that are trying to keep you down at the people you don’t want to be sat at that table anyway, to be honest. But there are brilliant people and LinkedIn has been such a core platform for TFR growing as a business. And for me developing myself and shaping my opinions and everything else out I'd always say to people start there because, it's a game changer. If you use it intentionally.
Max: You mentioned there about the value piece back and having something for them. And you know, running the mentoring programs stuff. A lot of people talk about reverse mentoring and stuff like that. But the difference in having someone that is showing up is willing, is eager and things like that and the hungry for it as well. It kind of feeds both sides and it really starts kind of this momentum continues.
Charlotte: We've become very transactional as a society and my team, they're on the business side of my team. I will say to them who have spoken to this week, and they'll be like, well, they said they wouldn't have budget until then. I'm like, so why aren't you talking to them? Where are your little saw this and thought of you, like what are you doing to add value to their days. And one of our clients went on to LinkedIn a few weeks ago, and she wrote this thing, and she was like, Charlotte's were one of the busiest people with the with big clients, and she will always pick up the phone. And that's just I'm driving around the bend with voice notes at the moment. But that side of it is such a soft skill that people have forgotten about, again, in the instant gratification of social media. We aren't building relationships that's very transactional, and people don't take the time anymore because they believe they're so busy doing things that they don't really need to be doing spending money on stuff that they, you know.
Max: Are busy being schooled or looking busy.
Mel: Busy is validating, isn't it? I'm busy, I'm valuable and you're like actually guys slowing down is one of the most important things we can do.
Charlotte: And I'll say to the team like I have achieved nothing today and I laughed, and I carried on like, it's not even a secret. I'm like, you know, just say it, they just know. But they also know bring in the sales. It's just, I just do it in a different way to what the Gurus are telling us that we shouldn't be doing.
Max: It's fascinating, isn't it? And that's kind of an honest conversation with the team to kind of distance them away from the noise. And so we kind of round these sessions up and what we've been talking about quite nicely leads into it, with asking what that one piece of advice, that one kind of quote, If you like that it's so good or so bad, that we need to pass it on or that you need to pass it on and we've had from previous guests the importance of time, and to really value that and think about, that we've also had the premise of leaning into it and being the person who kind of wants to be in acting that now, rather than waiting for it to happen, what would yours be?
Charlotte: So, I have a few. But I think the one that I say most frequently, which has a pop culture edge, of course is it's not that deep. I think that we overthink things. I think that we stop ourselves from doing things because we think that they're bigger than they are. I think that the fear of the word no. And the fear of failure stops us from moving forward. When in reality we're going to wake up the next day, like nothing would have really changed like it never is that bad, it never is that deep. That person's never thinking as badly of you as you think they are. It just isn't the reality, but we create our own reality. That is very rarely what ends up playing out.
Max: Love it. Love it.
Mel: Thank you so much for joining us, like I literally feel I need you in my pocket at all times for life advice. I'm gonna come back to this podcast time and time again.
Max: Be aimed at trying to become friends with something, that’s longer-term goal. Thanks so much for showing up today.
Charlotte: Thank you for having me.
Max: I can't tell you how much that conversation resonated, and I mean that sincerely from so many of the influences from social media to the lessons that that she lives by, and the integrity and just honesty that she kind of operates in our day to day, that just means that she's so authentic and it just cuts through the ball basically.
Mel: Absolutely. I mean, she's just got, even reading her letter, right? There's just energy off the page and this sense of self-belief, self-awareness, but also there's no arrogance in there whatsoever, this sense of I'm going to try it because no one is gonna stop me and I'm gonna give it a good go. And I love her refreshingly honest she is about, it's not all gone, right! I haven't got it right. I have made some bad calls. But actually, what I try and do is inspire other people to come up and give it a go. And I just think I'm gonna go back to that podcast so often for words of wisdom because I wish I had that kind of, I'm still learning how to have that kind of energy. And I think so many people will take so much from that.
Max: From junior, younger people, through to older, more senior, exactly that age. Just unapologetically real and but has made mistakes that just there's no apology for it because that's okay. It's okay to do that. It's how you react to it and her love for hip hop culture. Absolutely love as well.
Mel: And the energy and authenticity and that passion, you know, you see, I could have been in the agency, and I mean, I just excited to see her team and the kind of people that are there as well, because, gosh, I'm just bouncing off the walls here.
Max: Anywhere where you work within a 24-hour period. You're off onto a flight to Ibiza, and you're taking the team with you is only going to kind of inspire more and I've told her just before she left is that she can probably expect quite a few people asking for a job in the next few weeks.
Mel: Tenacity and energy and resilience and she said it herself to start an agency with that I've read a book. Like I've got 17 quid in the bank. I read a book. I've got this. I know what I'm doing. But you know, you can see it having just spent an hour with her that people saw that. That spark in her and believed in her and gave her the opportunity to create that first opportunity of keep your laptop. We're going to outsource this to you, and I think that's the thing is you have that spark and that brilliance, but you also need people to see it and I feel like Charlotte isn't somebody that just sits back and waits for someone to say it, like she brings her A game every time and she certainly did today.
Max: Like she says, what's the worst that can happen?
Mel: What's the worst that can happen?!
Max: Elevate operates, thanks to the generosity of our partners and supporters. To find out more about them, you can check them out via our website elevateme.co. Together, we're changing lives, careers and the events industry for the better.
Mel: This podcast was powered by Wonder the independent specialist creative business to business and business to employee events agency and a huge thanks goes to our producer and fellow Team Elevater Peter Kerwood.
What the industry says about our new podcast…
This podcast was powered by Wonder, an independent specialist creative events agency reimagining what’s possible across business experiences. They do this by helping businesses think differently about how they connect with the people that matter to them. We hugely appreciate their support bringing this podcast series to life.
Our sound and mix engineer is Matteo Magariello and our producer is Peter Kerwood.
About Elevate
Elevate is a pioneering free mentoring programme that has been designed with a specific goal in mind – to inspire, inform and empower people within the event industry.
Elevate operates thanks to the generosity of our partners and supporters; We Are Collider, PSP, Special Sauce, The Hoxton, ABPCO, CastleBell, event:decision, TIMES x10, tvg hospitality, and TRO. Together, we're changing lives, careers and the events industry for the better.